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Jul 10 2007, 11:21 AM
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#1
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Extremely Active Member Posts: 269 Joined: 15-September 05 Member No.: 3014 Using LabVIEW Since:1998 LV:7.1.1 ,8.0.1 ,8.20
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Jul 10 2007, 11:21 AM
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Jul 10 2007, 04:58 PM
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#2
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![]() Extwemely Active Premium Member ![]() Posts: 1621 Joined: 23-January 05 From: Here Member No.: 1431 Using LabVIEW Since:2003 LV:8.6 ,7.0 ,.
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I like the idea.
I think I actually saw another version once on NI's site. It's probably still there. -------------------- More than meets the eye...
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Jul 11 2007, 07:58 PM
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#3
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More Active Member Posts: 30 Joined: 15-June 07 Member No.: 8730 Using LabVIEW Since:2005 LV:7.1 ,. ,.
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I've been really interested in complex systems for years. Read a few books, part of Wolframs New Science, and even own a couple. But I'd sort of forgotten about it the last couple years. Great reminder. If I can pull some time I might go back and program some of the others I've come across, to learn more LabView and more complexity.
I'd add the ability to save the initial state of the system. I've played with it a few times and had outcomes that I really found intriguing, but then couldn't replicate, simply cause I clicked wantonly to create the original state, and therefore not only couldn't remember, but didn't really know what I started with. This post has been edited by jccorreu: Jul 11 2007, 08:06 PM -------------------- --
"Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernard Haisch
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Jul 12 2007, 05:16 PM
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#4
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![]() Active Member Posts: 21 Joined: 17-April 06 Member No.: 4775 Using LabVIEW Since:2005 LV:8.2.1 ,8.0.1 ,7.1
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Nice work! Very interesting to play with. I have read a little about complex systems as well. Any readings you have found particularly interesting?
This post has been edited by h1voltage: Jul 12 2007, 05:16 PM
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Jul 31 2007, 05:28 PM
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#5
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More Active Member Posts: 30 Joined: 15-June 07 Member No.: 8730 Using LabVIEW Since:2005 LV:7.1 ,. ,.
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Lets see...
there was Ludwig von Bertalanffy's "General Systems Theory". written decades ago, he was one fo the founding fathers of systems approach. It can get kind of statisical sometimes, but is really good at expressing the overlap that exists amongst fields, in the sense that patterns re-appear everywehere we look. Roger HIghfields "Frontiers of Complexity" Shows some if cellular automata research and results, and also how there is overlap amongst fields M Mitchel Waldrup "Complexity: Emerging Science.." this goes into the establishment of the Santa Fe institute, and how scientisit of differnet fields got together to teach each other what they were doing, and that they saw things the others already knew that could aid them in their own endeavors, again across fields. It thereofre also notes the repeating patterns throughout nature and human knowledge. And while I was playing with this, watching the evolution I jotted down a number of ideas for how else to play: instead of bouncing off the boarders, have option for them wrap around like a globe instead of making the rules hardcoded, make the ability to easily define the rules attempt to simulate civilization, stock market, ... I always thought it'd be neat to make a civilization game whose engine was based on rules of cellular automata, instead of the normal way of setting the rules, maybe it would become more like nauter and a better simulaiton save initial conditions, at stop ask if want to keep make "rules" which evolve option run "backwards"... any one set of starting conditions should only have one ending condition, but any one ending condition could have many starting conditions? choices would have to be made as to which path to come from for stagnation and repetition, forward and backward are the same we seem to be saying with this game that the future can be predicted but the past can not be known, strange that is the reverse of what we usually think hold down mouse and drag, left and right, one to turn on cells, the other to turn off different regions of the board have different rules different color cells have different rules can add "pulses" during the running of process, or have the same thing repeatedly put in at regular intervals, or when statis occurs, etc.. only reproduce if you find a mate. based on cell color. the preferences can change as well, perhaps based on past experience. -------------------- --
"Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernard Haisch
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Aug 2 2007, 10:36 PM
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#6
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Extremely Active Member Posts: 269 Joined: 15-September 05 Member No.: 3014 Using LabVIEW Since:1998 LV:7.1.1 ,8.0.1 ,8.20
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instead of bouncing off the boarders, have option for them wrap around like a globe A globe would mean that the left and right edges of the board are connected, but not the top and bottom (i.e. you can't get to the South Pole be walking north from the North Pole.) Trivia question: There is a shape described by a 2-D plane connected at the left and right edges and at the top and bottom edges. What is it? One addition I do want to make is that of an "infinite" field. That is, when the population gets to the edge, the whole field enlarges itself to add empty rows/columns. Therefore, nothing would ever hit an edge. QUOTE instead of making the rules hardcoded, make the ability to easily define the rules I would like to extend this to include different rulesets, but that's in the future. QUOTE I always thought it'd be neat to make a civilization game whose engine was based on rules of cellular automata, instead of the normal way of setting the rules, maybe it would become more like nauter and a better simulaiton You may want to check out SimEarth. It's an old game from the 80s, but did a similar thing. QUOTE option run "backwards"... any one set of starting conditions should only have one ending condition, but any one ending condition could have many starting conditions? choices would have to be made as to which path to come from This isn't possible. For a given state, there are any number of possible states that lead to it. Think of an empty field, with all the cells dead. What lead to it, a similar empty field, or a field with one cell that died of loneliness?
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Aug 2 2007, 11:06 PM
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#7
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![]() I'm a LAVA, not a fighter. V I Engineering, Inc. ![]() Posts: 3740 Joined: 13-October 03 From: Michigan, USA Member No.: 181 Using LabVIEW Since:1993 LV:8.5 ,. ,.
My Blog
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A globe would mean that the left and right edges of the board are connected, but not the top and bottom (i.e. you can't get to the South Pole be walking north from the North Pole.) Yes, you can't get to the South Pole by walking north from the North Pole, but you also can't get to the East Pole by walking west from the West Pole -------------------- ![]()
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Aug 2 2007, 11:34 PM
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#8
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![]() Extremely Active Premium Member ![]() Posts: 525 Joined: 18-October 05 From: Seattle, WA Member No.: 3266 Using LabVIEW Since:2005 LV:8.5 ,8.2.1 ,7.1.1
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Trivia question: There is a shape described by a 2-D plane connected at the left and right edges and at the top and bottom edges. What is it? mmmm...donut --------------------
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Aug 3 2007, 12:26 AM
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#9
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More Active Member Posts: 30 Joined: 15-June 07 Member No.: 8730 Using LabVIEW Since:2005 LV:7.1 ,. ,.
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DOH! Yes, simulating a globe would be slightly different. Now I think of it, the sims like civilization never actually emulated a globe, since technically that would mean portions of the top are connected with other portions of the side (er, I mean top, but that's a strange idea of a typo....), and likewise for the bottom. Might be neat action to add in also.
Strange I never heard of SimEarth, but looking it up on wikipedia makes it look quite intriguing to me. Of course, I doubt that its coded on the concepts of cellular automata, but who knows. I'll see if I can get a copy sometime and experiment. mwah, ha ha! This post has been edited by jccorreu: Aug 3 2007, 12:42 AM -------------------- --
"Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernard Haisch
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Aug 3 2007, 02:31 PM
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#10
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![]() I'm a LAVA, not a fighter. V I Engineering, Inc. ![]() Posts: 3740 Joined: 13-October 03 From: Michigan, USA Member No.: 181 Using LabVIEW Since:1993 LV:8.5 ,. ,.
My Blog
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Trivia question: There is a shape described by a 2-D plane connected at the left and right edges and at the top and bottom edges. What is it? A torus. -------------------- ![]()
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Aug 3 2007, 02:59 PM
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#11
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Extremely Active Member Posts: 269 Joined: 15-September 05 Member No.: 3014 Using LabVIEW Since:1998 LV:7.1.1 ,8.0.1 ,8.20
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Aug 3 2007, 03:14 PM
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#12
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![]() I'm a LAVA, not a fighter. V I Engineering, Inc. ![]() Posts: 3740 Joined: 13-October 03 From: Michigan, USA Member No.: 181 Using LabVIEW Since:1993 LV:8.5 ,. ,.
My Blog
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Nov 3 2007, 07:27 PM
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#13
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Extremely Active Member Posts: 269 Joined: 15-September 05 Member No.: 3014 Using LabVIEW Since:1998 LV:7.1.1 ,8.0.1 ,8.20
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I finally got around to updating this so you can load and save the state of the grid. It doesn't affect the cosmetic options (color, cell size, etc.), just which cells are alive and dead.
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